Advanced Elements AdvancedFrame Expedition Inflatable Kayak

Comments about Advanced Elements AdvancedFrame Expedition Inflatable Kayak:

Let me start off by saying a the most important things you want to know: If you are looking for a kayak but don't have a place to store one, (i.e., live in an apartment like me) this is a good bet. There are definite downsides to it, but overall when you're out on the water, you forget all things that are a pain, and remember why you wanted a kayak anyway.

This is the larger and heavier of the two inflatable Advanced Elements Kayaks. It is also roomier, more comfortable, more stable, and faster than the other (orange) one. I was given the orange one as a gift, and after using it returned it for the expedition (yellow) kayak. I have taken it out in all sorts of conditions and used it at least a dozen times. The biggest downside to this kayak is it is heavy. I bought a little portable 2 wheeled handcart to put the kayak on and transport it from my car to my apartment- it is not inconsiderable at 42 lbs, but when wet after using it weighs in the 60s. I also strap my paddle and the backbone which I purchased (ill go into later) to the bag so I can make less trips.

The kayak itself is easy to inflate, though you get tired it you do it all by hand. I recommend buying a $20 intex rechargeable electric pump which will get it most of the way there, and then top it off with the hand pump to make it firm. Once inflated, the kayak is pretty easy to enter, though its much easier to unzip the front zipper a bit to slip your feet in. There is a comfortable adjustable footrest, and the seat back has an inflatable lumbar adjustment, neither of which the orange kayak has.

In terms of speed, the kayak is not as fast as a hard body, but its almost there. It tracks very well most of the time, and is only frustrating when fighting a strong tail wind, which has the tendency to push the kayak around. The skeg on the bottom can get bent in one direction from sitting on the land, exacerbating this problem. AE recommends laying it upside in the sun and it will return to its normal shape - I have not had the opportunity to really do this yet.

I have taken the kayak out in VERY windy weather on open water with swells and white caps. If you know what you are doing, the kayak handles well facing into the headwind. Coming back is a pain as I explained. Along with the bad weather comes what I think is the other major draw back. The kayak has an inflatable comb to put an AE skirt around. Because of a design flaw (in my opinion) in both the skirt and the comb, it is extremely difficult to attach the skirt. You're not going to be rolling in this kayak, but if you have swells crashing over the boat, or tip sideways in rough water, a skirt would be nice to have. This skirt is useless. it also attaches to your body with suspenders, and if you lean forward to reach something on the deck, the back of the skirt pops off. If this happens in rough water you have to choose between not controlling your kayaking or having a skirt dangling at your waste - speaking from experience.

The only other big downside is aftercare - deflating the boat, rolling up a dirty kayak so that it fits in the duffle provided (not always an easy feat), and then when you return home, having somewhere to re-inflate it so that it can dry, or hose it off, clean it, dry it, repackage it, etc...

Now as I said at the beginning - with the downsides, and there are downsides, once I am out on the water and I know that without this kayak I wouldn't have one, I forget all about the trouble it is, and enjoy my hours on the water. I wouldn't use it on anything over a class 2 rapid, but you can use this kayak for river, lake, sound, bay - virtually an ocean worthy kayak except for the skirt issue.

When you're in the kayak, even if inflated fully, when you are going over swells or wake sometimes you can feel them through the bottom of the boat. I purchased the backbone, which adds another layer of pain in the *** to assembling it, because you have to take out the floor and then reinsert it, but for rougher water it makes a big different. It adds stability, better tracking, and eliminates the 'flexing' you feel. Some people complained they could feel a pole under their seat. I weigh 150 lbs - I cant feel it at all.

I have had one problem with the boat that let me to return my first one to REI, but I repurchased it because i like it so much. In my first boat, after a couple of trips one of the side tubes, which hold the shape of the kayak, got a kink in it and bent inwards when inflated. It totally ruined the boat. I called AE and they told me to just deflate it, unzip the baffles and manually move the tube around to get the kink out, and that this was normal. Needless to say after hours spent trying to fix it, I gave up and returned it. I've had the new boat for a year and no similar problems.

But, thats why you buy from REI - problem with the boat, or your dont like it, you can return it and someone else gets a good discount.

Overall - if you are tight on space, really want to kayak and not depend on rentals, and don't mind the tedium of taking care of this thing, I would highly recommend it.

If, on the other hand, you have room for a hard shell and are just looking for a cheaper alternative or something more portable - save up and buy a hard shell and a rack for your car. That's what I plan to do when I have a house to store one.

PS
A word about my experience, I am not competitive, but I have been on multi-week sea kayaking trips in the great lakes and in the ocean, and have been white water kayaking about two dozen times. Take that for what its worth -

Comments about Advanced Elements AdvancedFrame Expedition Inflatable Kayak:

I was prepared to write a long, in-depth and detailed review of this kayak and it's features but I decided to stick to the basics and provide real world conditions I have experienced in the month I have had the Expedition. If you choose to stop reading this review from this point forward, let me leave you with one thought...The Advanced Elements Expedition is never the same experience twice. In this case, that's a bad thing. First off, you should know I have no experience with any other kayak. I did not test any others and bought the Expedition site unseen. My main reasoning for purchasing a kayak was for a unique form of fitness not for recreation. I wanted something that would allow me to increase my heart rate, strengthen my shoulders and core, burn some calories, and ultimately help me lose weight. I have taken this kayak out a lot in the first 2 months - an average of 3 times per week for 7 weeks. The majority of my paddling has taken place on a large lake in both calm, glassy conditions and with a light wind chop. I have also recently taken it on a swift moving river with a small amount of churn - probably Class 2. The very nature of a folding kayak lends itself to great portability but each time you fold and unfold it something will shift or reposition. I spend a great deal of time during setup moving, squeezing, dragging, and turning the inflation chambers and floor to make sure it lines up just right. If you don't and it's slightly off center or the main chamber is kinked you will not track in a straight line. Other reviewers have praised how well this boat tracks but only 2 or 3 times I can think of did it move straight when coasting. Like a car with suspension problems the Expedition either pushes to the right or pulls to the left - not severely but enough to be annoying. Some days are worse than others. One day I can go out and have a nearly effortless time but the very next, following the exact same setup routine I end up working twice as hard trying to keep it straight with each stroke. Last Saturday after setup the kayak looked perfect, everything was aligned, inflation pressure was dead on, and the skeg on the bottom was straight - but for every stroke to the left I took two strokes on the right because it wanted to swing hard to starboard. It was so frustrating I quit after 15 minutes. Upon inspection I could see no visible reason for the drift and there were no currents or wind on the lake. But on Sunday - same setup, same conditions, same everything and, you guessed it, straight as an arrow. If you're not committed to spending a little extra time when unpacking it to get everything aligned just right you could end up being frustrated. Personally I would rather have the same predictable ride each and every time. You won't get that with an inflatable and you need to know that going in. Expedition supporters will undoubtedly question whether or not I have been following instructions and I can assure you I have been.Keep in mind, I'm not bashing this kayak, I'm just stating facts I have experienced. I still like it overall. Now having said all that, I don't think you can find a much better value. I bought mine the day there was an extra sale going on. I only paid [$]. You would be hard pressed to find a 13' touring kayak for that price anywhere. Of course, by the time you add paddles (must have a cheap emergency paddle too) and all the safety gear I was into for about $850. Some things you simply can't skimp on. Safety is important - especially if you start your paddling adventures in the dead of winter like I did. One spill in 35 degree water and you only have about 15 minutes to find safety and warmth before hypothermia sets in. Again, that's not complaining just something you need to be aware of when you start thinking about your overall budget. Inside the Expedition keeps you warm and cozy though and the fact it's inflatable means it is comfortable - no hard spots to sit on. I continue to be amazed at how rigid this boat is despite that fact it's full of nothing but air. Okay, so where does that leave this review? For me it's easy. No matter how frustrating the setup process is (like others have described as well) and no matter ho much energy I expend inflating it with the hand pump all of the negatives are neutralized completely by the fact that you can fold it up and take it with you anywhere! I love knowing that I can store this thing in my car and spontaneously explore the local waterways wherever I am. You can't do that with a plastic kayak and have to plan ahead. Just keep you paddling gear and kayak together and you're ready to explore. It fits in the back of my pickup truck or in my wife's Honda Accord. So despite the challenges, I would recommend this kayak to anyone wanting to have something easy to transport. It's a little more work to achieve a smooth ride but provides the freedom to explore that others don't. I hope this was helpful. Happy paddling.

Comments about Advanced Elements AdvancedFrame Expedition Inflatable Kayak:

I have had this kayak for 3 years use it as often as I can. My friends have all used it. We are all old women and we take our little terriers with us (they fit perfectly on the front end) to all the high Cascade lakes!!! I was actually thinking about getting a third ( I have 2 already), maybe a tandem size!! It's more comfortable than a hard shell, easy to pump up, easy to load in & out of the car. Even when recovering from knee surgery.... It actually made me change my mind from getting a hard shell. For my use it's perfect!

Comments about Advanced Elements AdvancedFrame Expedition Inflatable Kayak:

First off, it came in the mail... I didn't have to buy a car rack and haul it. It folds up to about the size of my camping pack. After my first trip down the river, I've come to love it. There is plenty of room for storage, with a little tweaking the seating is comfortable, and it's much easier on your backside by the end of the day. You can un zip the deck and kick your legs out, I actually had a nice snooze while reclining in mine today. Very stable, probably the most stable kayak I've been in.

The reason for only 4 stars is that with the way the kayak sits in the water, it tends to catch wind, but not so much water current. I had a strong head wind, and even with the river pushing me, I still had a little trouble keeping it straight. As long as you keep paddling, it tracks well. I suspect it will be very fast with the wind at my back.

Otherwise, it has become my new favorite toy.

Comments about Advanced Elements AdvancedFrame Expedition Inflatable Kayak:

I bought this kayak (AE Expedition 2009 model) as an upgrade from another inflatable kayak. I'm glad I did. The build quality is excellent, the amount of detail to it's construction, and the ease of maintenance.
My planned uses are recreational/excercise and to use in paddling/photography excursions.

I looked for something that can handle a lot of weight if necessary. I live in a condo with no garage, so an inflatable is my best choice. Plus I don't like taking long trips with a kayak on top of my vehicle.

I see other reviewers complain about the AE Expedition being slow. Think about it...it's designed to carry 450 lbs!!! Look at the ridged kayaks. A comparable size and weight ridged kayak will only handle 220~320 lbs. That's like comparing an SUV with a sports car! So of course they're going to paddle faster, but not by much.

As for the Backbone being uncomfortable, I really don't understand. I weigh over 210 lbs., and never feel any discomfort from the back bone. Perhaps they're not reading the manual...it goes UNDER the mattress. I've spent hours in my Expedition, it's like being in a floating lazy boy chair. I find myself trying to think of a good reason to get out. One little tip, unzip the top front zipper a bit and open the coaming to make it easier to get in and out. Once you're in...you can zip it up all the way and close up the coaming.

I've taken my Expedition to Cape Cod Bay, Eastham Salt Pond Bay, Long Island Sound (many times), Housatonic Lake (many times), and the Connecticut River in Vermont. It's all been good. I've had close encounters with reckless boater coming too close and the Expedition kept stable through their wake and swells.

My only cons is the clean up afterward. However, that would be true with ANY inflatable, especially after salt water use.
What's good is that the Expedition can be completly dismantled to assure thorough washing and dry-off. Rassling the Kayak back into the carrying bag is probably the worst part.

If you read the manual, get your assembly/disassembly down to a science, and realize there's a bit more work to inflatables...you'll be much better off.

Comments about Advanced Elements AdvancedFrame Expedition Inflatable Kayak:

I am a fat older womyn and fit into this very well. This kayak is very comfortable, but very hard work to dry, deflate, and fold up. I don't use the bag it came with, too small. I found the backbone very painful to sit on, so I cut up a foam pool float and installed it under the seat. That did the job. The front unzips so you can sunbath, carry a dog, or even take a nap. You can fold it, toss in the back of the car, and go home, doing the clean-up the next day. VERY HEAVY WHEN WET

Comments about Advanced Elements AdvancedFrame Expedition Inflatable Kayak:

I've used it twice on the Puget Sound in Seattle. Setup/infalation is fairly quick (15 minutes) and pretty easy. The kayak is extremely stable, tracks well, and is easy to use. I thoroughly enjoyed the two trips I've taken so far. It is slow - your hard shell buddies will need to be leisurely. If you have a long way to carry it - either get the luggage carrier or get help - you do not want to carry the bag very far since it's pretty heavy @ 42lbs.

Comments about Advanced Elements AdvancedFrame Expedition Inflatable Kayak:

The portability of this boat makes it great for those with small cars and limited storage space. It is not the fastest boat, but it maneuvers well. It is also more comfortable to sit in than a lot of the cheaper plastic boats.

Comments about Advanced Elements AdvancedFrame Expedition Inflatable Kayak:

We are two older women. Boat was easy to inflate, but difficult to completely dry out and fold up properly. Took over an hour because of the chambers. Very difficult to carry because it sagged in the middle. The cowling is too flexible so the spray skirt pops off. The "backbone" hurt to sit on as it is a round pipe under the air floor. We took it back. I think it would be great for a young & fit paddler who must have the portability. Well made.

Comments about Advanced Elements AdvancedFrame Expedition Inflatable Kayak:

I picked up this boat for nature watching and exercise on local lakes. As an apartment dweller I don't have space to store a rigid kayak and as a frequent traveler I had a vague idea I might take it with me on trips.

I liked the idea that it would go from car trunk to the water quickly, allowing after-work and spur-of-the-moment boating. It does go together quickly... with a good pump it can be inflated and ready to paddle in under 10 minutes.

As a nature watching platform it works well. Stable, it provides a steady platform for coasting slowly and not disturbing wildlife. I could paddle it easily at a little over 3.5kts (per my GPS) and could make 2kts very quietly and with minimal paddling.

Build quality is high. The boat feels very sturdy and branches, rocks, etc are non-issues.

Once done for the day the boat is easily deflated and folded for transport back home. A bungee cord makes the job quicker but 5 minutes from landing to driving is possible either way.

Now for the reality check.

While you may be on your way home after 5 minutes, you are by no stretch done for the day. Once you get home you've got to unpack the boat, disassemble it enough to get the floor out, inflate it, pat it dry, clean the corners, and probably leave it out and at least partially inflated so the sun can dry it a bit.

Also, the first time I took it out it had horrible tracking problems that varied with speed. After disassembling and fiddling with the inflatable floor I could reduce but not fully eliminate those issues. Subsequent use revealed a tendency to kink the main tube, which would also result in tracking issues and was harder to sort out. Suddenly a 10-minute time-to-water becomes 20 to get a well tuned boat.

So a single trip to the water can involve 3 inflate/deflate cycles and close to an hour of fiddling. I wound up cutting that number by driving to the lake with the boat in my trunk, but returning with the boat on my roof. Not something everyone would want to do. In fact, I think I got more exercise carrying and inflating/deflating the boat than paddling.

Which leaves us with a travel boat... it is a lot better than any rigid hull but not as good as I hoped. The duffel starts out the size and weight of a large suitcase. The design, with it's air mattress floor and cloth structure to form the inflatable sections into kayak shape, traps water and doesn't dry out easily, even when partially disassembled and left in the sun, so the weight goes up after use and doesn't come down immediately. It would be great, however, in an RV or taking along on any sort of road trip. A short (week or two) trip wouldn't require the elaborate drying and clean-up efforts until the end. The overwhelming argument for this boat (and the smaller sibling) is to have along on road trips. If that was the only factor I would've given two more stars at least.

The final straw for me was ergonomics. The seat advertises adjustable lumbar support...not sure what anatomy class the designer took but it probably wasn't human. The lumbar region is higher up. The under deck area was insufficient for my size 12 shoes.

I have now upgraded to a Pakboat. It has its own quirks but is significantly better adapted to my use, including travel. Pakboat seats are also light-years ahead of the AdvancedFrame Expedition seat.